Normally, much of my so-called "poetry" is responded to with a big "Ho-hum!" but my recent thoughts on the Jeremy Corbyn leadership election inspired this chat on FizzBok which I'm presenting today for you to mull over.
http://m-a-w-h.blogspot.co.uk/2015/08/jc.html
CN: I'm a JC supporter, but I'm afraid you're probably right...
http://m-a-w-h.blogspot.co.uk/2015/08/jc.html
CN: I'm a JC supporter, but I'm afraid you're probably right...
MH: Hence my "work in progress" - I completely understand his position, wish there were more like him, and understand how he appeals amidst a sea of photocopied "professional politicians in suits" but knowing that he'll be 71 years old by the time of the next election really makes him unelectable (in my opinion) in the current "youth (and image) obsessed culture", especially when the "Young vs Old" war seems to be getting more stirred up by the numpties the country voted in in May. I may be wrong, I hope I am, but with the main opposition hell-bent on self-destruction anyway, why the hell not, eh? (Never wise to discuss politics, I know!)
CN: I know, I've always avoided discussing politics too, partly to avoid arguments and also because I've never held out much hope of anything ever changing. But, I have been feeling more angry and motivated than usual since the general election and during the current leadership election. I do fear you're right though. I don't realistically see him being PM either, as you said his age and image and the opposition of the right-wing press will be hard to get past, and I'm afraid the JC campaign is probably destined to be a short-lived protest movement. I hope not though. I can hope, right? :-)
MH: I honestly don't know. Maybe there will be a sea-change in the attitudes of "people" (though, I've not got much time for "people" at the best of times, as you know). The problem remains arithmetical anyway. Thanks to the referendum last year, TLP have made themselves pretty much unelectable in Scotland now (who in Scotland would now vote in favour of more control from Westminster?) and without those seats the 300 that will generally always vote for TCP in England remain an almost insurmountable obstacle. This is where the PR argument always gains ground, but if you look at the way we might have been now under PR it's actually quite frightening given the rise of the right. Plus, it's not going to happen anyway because it's not in the interests of the governing party, whatever it is. The problem I have is that in my heart I'm an idealist, but my head remains firmly realist, and I can't see these numpties being overthrown in five or even ten years, no matter what they do. Britain generally likes the status quo and as long as "people" think that "something new" is going to cost them personally, I don't think they'll ever vote for something "radical"
CN: Yes, it's a sad reflection on our country, but true nevertheless. However, it does look like he may win this round at least, so we should have interesting times ahead.
MH: :-)
AH: Well I have spent my three quid and he is getting my vote. Otherwise we abandon all hope of change for the better.
CN: Mine too. The Labour website has gone into meltdown :-)
AH: He will walk the leadership. Then we shall see, he has five years to build a better party.
EP: Powerful stuff Mr H.
MH: Or not, obviously…
AH: Great poem, but I hope you are wrong. Without a chance we will be America in twenty years or so. I am supporting Corbyn regardless of age, and I think that he will surprise us all.
MH: I don't hold his age against him, I just remember the front pages from the '83 election, and also that the next election is four years away.
AH: Maybe it is time for he elder statesman once more. I don't think he is as odd as Foot came across.
MH: Maybe… although, ironically, Mr Foot was far more centrist than he was given credit for.
AH: And I am sure that once Corbyn is leader that he will be a little more centrist too. He's no fool and needs to lead the party, not drag it along kicking and screaming. I have yet to decide who I will vote for as his deputy, but I probably won't go for a left-minded candidate.
MH: I also remember the press being full of stuff like this
AH: let's see what the press say when he runs away with this election. Michael Foot was bonkers in the eyes of just about everyone and Tony Benn added to that fatal mix. Let's hope Corbyn has the sense to keep his friends close and his enemies even closer.
MH: Rupert is waiting to pounce. It may get ugly. :-(
AH: Even Murdoch might need to take care.
MH: Actually, that's very true. He might very well underestimate the level of contempt that this current bunch of power junkies are already being held in by his readership.
LATER:
MH: :-)
AH: Yes the Labour MP's are beginning to panic. The problem with Corbyn is that he turns their cosy, London focused, plastic, privileged world upside down and the electorate (well more of them than for quite a while) think he'll be good for Labour and like him as a person. Yes, like him. Imagine that, a politician being liked instead of feared, detested and mistrusted.
CN: He'll win this, but he's going to have a tough time ahead of him, for all the reasons Martin mentioned earlier. I would love to believe that a likeable, transparent, sincere person could lead the country though.
AH: it will be tough, but he strikes me as tough and he will make concessions and compromises and gather a good shadow cabinet around him and make a difference I hope. The Labour Party should wake up to the opportunity he presents and not keep going on about train crashes and listening to Blair and his failed Blairites. For the first time in years people are rallying to a cause, not simply going along the road of the safest option with 'what choice to I have?' He may be a brilliant Prime Minister, he could make people happy, he might even unravel this bloody awful mess that Thatcher, Blair and now Cameron and his Eton boys have made of this great land of ours. The game's afoot; Follow your spirit: and upon this charge, Cry — God for Jeremy! England and Saint George!
CN: You're right, I feel like I've finally woken up after twenty years or more of political apathy. We could make this happen!
MH: This has all been very interesting (especially as I just started knocking together a daft poem to get my thoughts in order). Meanwhile, I still maintain that much of the last election was decided on the idea that there was definitely going to be a coalition, and we're all reaping the unfortunate results of there not being, and the "absolute power " of implementing a ridiculously over the top manifesto.
AH: In terms of the Deputy for me it is Tom Watson. He will be the sensible echo that Corbyn might need, a moderator but also a man of belief. And he can get things done.
AH:You are right Martin. I was voting for a coalition given that the Labour leadership of the time was not at all palatable.
CN: Yes I like the sound of him too. He has a good track record of standing up to bad people.
AH: Yep.
MH: There was also a certain amount of the politics of fear stirred up, too. One of my wilder theories is that much of the voting in Scotland was on the understanding that there would be positions in cabinet come the glorious day, and not merely additional shouty voices being ignored on the opposition benches. I still think that a ninety day "are you sure that's what you wanted?" return option on your vote might not be the worst idea I've ever had, but now I'm just getting silly. All this political talk, when talking politics is one of the biggest no-nos that there is. ;-)
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